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Windows Forum / Virtual PC / May 2008Snapshots?
I am a VMWare Workstation user new to Virtual PC. I had a lot of problems getting Vista to run in Workstation 5.5. It works fine in Virtual PC. However, there appears to be an essential element for a virtual machine missing in Virtual PC. In VMWare, I use snapshots a lot. I can't find any way to do that in Virtual PC. Undo disks is confusing and it isn't the same as simply taking a snapshot and then choosing what snapshot to use (I have about 30 for each virtual machine I have in VMWare). So, is there a way to take a snapshot in Virtual PC? If not why? That is essential seems to me. If Undo disks is used, that would put the pc back the way it was before that session began, correct? So, somewhat similar to Snapshots. However, no way to save a state like a snapshot would do...right? > I am a VMWare Workstation user new to Virtual PC. I had a lot of problems > getting Vista to run in Workstation 5.5. It works fine in Virtual PC. [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > Snapshots. However, no way to save a state like a snapshot would > do...right? Just buy Vmware Workstation 6 and be happy. If you can't dish out the money for it (you should) then download the free Vmware Server. Development for VPC died long ago. Don't bother using it. >Development for VPC died long ago. That's not correct.  SignatureBob Comer <Microsoft MVP Windows - Virtual Machine> >> I am a VMWare Workstation user new to Virtual PC. I had a lot of problems >> getting Vista to run in Workstation 5.5. It works fine in Virtual PC. [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > >Development for VPC died long ago. Don't bother using it. On May 23, 8:26 am, Robert Comer <bobcomer-remove...@mindspring.com> wrote: > >Development for VPC died long ago. > [quoted text clipped - 24 lines] > > >Development for VPC died long ago. Don't bother using it. Let me rephrase that. Development of VPC that VPC users can benefit from died long ago. Better? I'll still say not correct to that. SignatureBob Comer >On May 23, 8:26 am, Robert Comer <bobcomer-remove...@mindspring.com> >wrote: [quoted text clipped - 32 lines] > >Better? >On May 23, 8:26 am, Robert Comer <bobcomer-remove...@mindspring.com> >wrote: [quoted text clipped - 32 lines] > >Better? So why do you even bother to waste your time monitoring this newsgroup and providing non-answers? SignatureCheers, Steve Jain, Virtual Machine MVP http://vpc.essjae.com/ I do not work for Microsoft. What do you call this? https://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?familyid=28c97d22-6eb8-4a09-a7f 7-f6c7a1f000b5&displaylang=en Notice that the publish date is 5/15/2008. That is the date SP1 released to the public. You just flat don't know what you are talking about. > On May 23, 8:26 am, Robert Comer <bobcomer-remove...@mindspring.com> > wrote: [quoted text clipped - 39 lines] > > Better? > What do you call this?https://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?familyid=28c97d22-6e... > Notice that the publish date is 5/15/2008. That is the date SP1 released to [quoted text clipped - 47 lines] > > > Better? This is sarcasm right? Your joking around? I'm sorry but the SP's released for VPC after VPC was bought pale in comparison to what Connectix was doing with the product before and they pale in comparison to what other VM products are doing right now to evolve their software. You honestly cannot tell me that you believe that the SP's for VPC have been in any way shape or form are in any way significant to users usage of VPC. I realize it's free software (even thought those of us actually paid for the product in the past) but that doesn't mean you have to throw wool over your eyes and refuse to face the facts. As for not providing answers I did provide an answer if you care to read the thread. Snapshots in Vmware will solve his problem nicely or possibly the snapshot feature in VirtualBox (Free and still being developed by Sun Software) but I haven't gotten around to using the feature in that product yet. You are being just plain silly. >> What do you call >> this?https://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?familyid=28c97d22-6e... [quoted text clipped - 73 lines] > developed by Sun Software) but I haven't gotten around to using the > feature in that product yet. What are you talking about? SP1 for VPC 2007 just released this week. If that is not new development I don't know what is. Are you thinking about VPC 7 for PPC Macs? Development has ended for that. >> I am a VMWare Workstation user new to Virtual PC. I had a lot of >> problems [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] > > Development for VPC died long ago. Don't bother using it. Top-posting corrected >>> I am a VMWare Workstation user new to Virtual PC. I had a lot of >>> problems [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] >> >> Development for VPC died long ago. Don't bother using it. <c.barnhorst@comcast.net> wrote: >What are you talking about? SP1 for VPC 2007 just released this week. If >that is not new development I don't know what is. Are you thinking about >VPC 7 for PPC Macs? Development has ended for that. Is it completely impossible for users of this newsgroup to refrain from top-posting, thus destroying any possibility of easily following the discussion flow??? This particular thread with is subbranches is a perfect example of the mess created by this mal-practice where some users top-post and others correctly bottom-post, but noone cares to correct the structure so it is almost impossible to see what the reply is a reply to. Yikes! > Is it completely impossible for users of this newsgroup to refrain > from top-posting, thus destroying any possibility of easily following > the discussion flow??? If you're going to complain about people's posting habits it would behoove you to make sure that you yourself follow proper posting etiquette. Since your post was nothing more than a rant about other's posting habits, none of the text you quoted was necessary and should not have been quoted. People that live in glass houses... SignaturePaul Adare http://www.identit.ca Manual Writer's Creed: Garbage in, gospel out. > Is it completely impossible for users of this newsgroup to refrain > from top-posting, thus destroying any possibility of easily following > the discussion flow??? Of all the groups in which I post regularly, this one is by far the worst for top-posting. Some of the "regulars" seem almost to delight in doing it, as if the deliberate flaunting of netiquette shows what tough guys they are... SignatureMark Rae ASP.NET MVP http://www.markrae.net Wrong. Top posting brings out the wannabe netcop whiners and is entertaining. > > Is it completely impossible for users of this newsgroup to refrain > > from top-posting, thus destroying any possibility of easily following [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > as if the deliberate flaunting of netiquette shows what tough guys they > are... Mark and Bo, this is a Virtual PC newsgroup, not an NNTP nettiquette group, keep on topic. And yes, I do top and in-line post, but only for clarity and not having to scroll. It's no tough guy act... There is no "law" that bottom posting only is allowed, and indeed, top posting is more common on Usenet these days. SignatureBob Comer >Of all the groups in which I post regularly, this one is by far the worst >for top-posting. Some of the "regulars" seem almost to delight in doing it, >as if the deliberate flaunting of netiquette shows what tough guys they >are... >> Is it completely impossible for users of this newsgroup to refrain >> from top-posting, thus destroying any possibility of easily following [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] >as if the deliberate flaunting of netiquette shows what tough guys they >are... My belief is that very many are using Microsoft mail programs (like Outlook) also for newsgroup communications. And with Outlook it is *very* difficult to get replies properly organized... At work I have to use Outlook and therefore I very seldom reply to a thread... At home I use Forté Agent and proper formatting is "built in". Why are so many using Microsoft mail programs here? Beats me, but maybe because it is a Microsoft newsserver and group? I usually manage to decode the postings but this particular thread got *very* difficult because every other respondent used top posting and the other bottom posting so in order to read the information flow one had to start in the middle and then guess when to look down and up... Bo Berglund There's nothing exactly like snapshots in VPC. You can kind of do the same thing with differencing disks, but you have to shut down the guest to make a differencing disk. Just read in the help about differencing disks. fwiw, the new Hyper-V has snapshots, so that's the direction Microsoft is going. Maybe the follow-on to VPC2007 will have them. SignatureBob Comer <Microsoft MVP Windows - Virtual Machine> >I am a VMWare Workstation user new to Virtual PC. I had a lot of problems >getting Vista to run in Workstation 5.5. It works fine in Virtual PC. [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] >Snapshots. However, no way to save a state like a snapshot would >do...right? > There's nothing exactly like snapshots in VPC. You can kind of do the > same thing with differencing disks, but you have to shut down the [quoted text clipped - 19 lines] >>Snapshots. However, no way to save a state like a snapshot would >>do...right? I recall reading about differencing disks but I don't remember the details off hand. It is disappointing that there is no way to take snapshots. I tried Virtual PC back in late 2004 and also tried VMWare Workstation and there was really no comparison back then. VMWare was far superior. Both were paid products then so it was no brainer to go with VMWare. I had not tried Virtual PC since then until the middle of this month when Vista, on VMWare Workstation 5.5, was gone when I went to boot up. It had installed just fine and everything was working well until a few days later when I had to reboot the host and had to shut Vista down. When I went to reboot, VMWare couldn't find the machine. It was right where it was supposed to be but Workstation couldn't access it. I got no help in the VMWare forums. I tried several things and made matters worse. Vista is considered experimental on Workstation 5.5 anyway. So, I decided to try Virtual PC (now I recall I decided this after reading a post at my home site about Virtual PC 2007 SP1 just being released). I must say this version of Virtual PC is much improved over 2004. If it had snapshot ability, I'd be quite happy with it because in other ways it works great and has some advantages over Workstation 5.5 (I don't know about 6). I cannot understand why Microsoft would not provide snapshot ability. Snapshots are a major reason for using virtual machines ...at least in the home environment. I use virtual machines for beta testing and simply not saving the session isn't going to work. With betas, I would not rely on System Restore either. I need snapshots. I'll use it for now because I sure won't be doing any beta testing on Vista for a long time. I'm struggling just to figure Vista out....fighting with it a lot. Vista is very pretty and has improved networking. In most other ways though XP Pro is superior IMO. Everything, except Networking, is a struggle on Vista. I spent a whole day trying to figure out how to drop a file from the host onto Vista. I finally found a solution in a Microsoft forum but it is ridiculous what I have to do so I can drop a shared file onto Vista. I hate, really, really hate all the security crap on Vista. I spent the first few days just turning all that off and getting Vista as much like XP as I could. >>>I am a VMWare Workstation user new to Virtual PC. I had a lot of problems >>>getting Vista to run in Workstation 5.5. It works fine in Virtual PC. [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] >>>Snapshots. However, no way to save a state like a snapshot would >>>do...right? >> There's nothing exactly like snapshots in VPC. You can kind of do the >> same thing with differencing disks, but you have to shut down the [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] >> fwiw, the new Hyper-V has snapshots, so that's the direction Microsoft >> is going. Maybe the follow-on to VPC2007 will have them. >I recall reading about differencing disks but I don't remember the details >off hand. It is disappointing that there is no way to take snapshots. AFAIK the differencing disks are great if you want to create multiple test systems but want to limit the disk usage on the host. What differencing disks do is the following: - You start out normally by creating your base bachine and installing the operating system with all its updates and gizmos. - Once you are satisfied with the way the guest looks and behaves you close it down and from now you never again start it. - For safety change the virtual disk file for the guest to ReadOnly. - Next create a new virtual hard disk using the Virtual Disk Wizard (File/Virtual Disk Wizard). Instructions from the VPC2007 help below. - Now you have a differencing disk and you can create a new guest and at the disk selection step rowse to this differencing disk as the guest disk. - Repeat as many times as you need separate guests based on the same ase disk. These guest disks will only store the *changes* you make from the original disk so they will remain considerably smaller than the base disk. Notice that this is not a snapshot by a long way as can be seen from the involved way to create the differencing disk in the first place. It would be nice if the "New virtual machine" wizard could give an option to create the new guest disk as a differencing disk. This way one would not have to first make the disk and then make the guest. From VPC2007 Help on making a differencing disk: ------------------------------------------------ In the Disk Options dialog box, click Create a new virtual disk, and then click Next. In the Virtual Disk Type dialog box, click A virtual hard disk, and then click Next. By default, the wizard creates the virtual hard disk in the My Documents folder. If you want to store the virtual hard disk in a different location, type the full path of this location when you specify the virtual hard disk name or click Browse to find it. In the Virtual Hard Disk Location dialog box, type a name for the virtual hard disk, and then click Next. In the Virtual Hard Disk Type dialog box, click Differencing, and then click Next. In the Differencing Virtual Hard Disk dialog box, type the name of the parent disk or click Browse to find it, click Next, and then click Finish. >So, I decided to try Virtual PC (now I recall I decided this after reading a >post at my home site about Virtual PC 2007 SP1 just being released). I must [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] >saving the session isn't going to work. With betas, I would not rely on >System Restore either. I need snapshots. There are other shortcomings as well in VPC2007, one of the major ones being the inability to link a USB device over from the host to the guest so it can be used there. For me and my collegues the most important such use is to handle software protection dongles that are nowadays almost uniquely USB. Without that VPC2007 cannot be used for software testing on protected programs... But VMWare WorkStation 6 and Player 2 both support this function and Player is as free as VPC2007 (the fact that you cannot directly create a guest in Player 2 is overcome by websites that offer to make the needed files for you). >onto Vista. I hate, really, really hate all the security crap on Vista. I >spent the first few days just turning all that off and getting Vista as much >like XP as I could. Oh, another soul-mate! I also cannot fathom the security interventions of Vista so I will use my trusty old XP as long as possible. |
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