%*&#@$!! Bloody Registry... Looking for non-existing(?) utility....

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FlyBoy - 27 Oct 2004 13:46 GMT

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAARRRGGGHHH!!!!!!.........................................................

@#$%^&* Computers @#$%^&*!!!

I won't tell you what I have gone through with defective hardware
before I got to this point but I REALLY would like something to work
as it should right now.

Here's the situation...

New MoBo Gigabyte 7N400 Pro2 (Rev. 2) Socket-A with 3000+ Athlon XP.
Multi-boot HD with amongst others Win98SE which did boot on old MoBo.

Cannot boot in normal mode or safe mode. Get fatal exceptions 06, 0B
and 0E.

Repair-install over existing OS results in reporting a problem with
registry after 1st reboot after file-copying, automatically restoring
registry-backup and another reboot resulting in aborting the install
and never reaching HW-detection phase of re-install.

Scanreg /fix "repairs" but also deletes 3/4 of registry including all
uninstall information in Configuration>Software.

So I can't get into Windows to use an adequate registry repair utility
because all these stupid programs require Windows to run.

How am I expected to repair my registry when the problem with the
registry prohibits me from booting?

I need a clean/repair utility that is capable to repair the registry
of ANOTHER Windows installation. I have a second Win98SE on the same
drive that does boot but the other one is my main OS with roughly 280
software-installs in it so it would be a bit of a pain to do that all
over again.

Anyone?..... Please.......

Reply to this Message

Ron Badour - 27 Oct 2004 15:07 GMT

You cannot repair install (I assume you mean installing W98 over the
existing load of W98) and expect that to fix the registry because it can't.
It has been my experience that installing over the top of a multi-patched
system creates more problems than it fixes. So, if I cannot fix a problem,
I bite the bullet and do a clean installation of the system and all
software.

It sounds like the registry is corrupt--have you tried restoring a backed up
copy?

Ways of restoring the W98 registry include:

On the Start Menu, select Shut Down and Restart in MSDOS Mode. At the
Windows prompt, type: scanreg /restore and hit enter.

Boot to the boot menu by holding down either the ctrl or F8 key after the
ram count occurs on the boot screen. Select Command Prompt Only and at the
C: prompt, type: scanreg /restore and hit enter.

Boot with the W98 start up floppy disk--CDRom support doesn't matter. At
the A: prompt, type: C: and hit enter. At the C: prompt, type: CD
Windows\Command and hit enter. At the Command prompt, type: scanreg
/restore and hit enter.

Once the registry restore screen appears, select the date of the registry
that you wish to restore by highlighting it and then click enter. If you
see a registry named: Rbbad.cab, that is a copy of the registry that has
already been replaced.

Signature

Regards

Ron Badour, MS MVP for W98
Tips: http://home.satx.rr.com/badour
Knowledge Base Info:
http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx?pr=kbinfo

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAARRRGGGHHH!!!!!!.................................
........................

> @#$%^&* Computers @#$%^&*!!!
>
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>
> Anyone?..... Please.......

Reply to this Message

WoofWoof - 27 Oct 2004 15:36 GMT

As I understand it (correct me if I'm wrong), you have changed
motherboards on a system with Windows already installed.

As far as I know, the only *officially* (Microsoft) recommended way to
do this is to do a clean re-install of windows at the same time so
that it can set itself up for the new hardware.

The unofficial way (allowing you to keep the existing windows
installation) is (before you swap MB's) to delete the section of the
registry where the hardware is recorded. (I believe it's the whole
"enum" section, but it's a long while since I did it that way and
someone else here should confirm). Then you install the new MB,
re-boot and windows is forced to redetect the hardware.

You can also accomplish the same thing without editing the registry,
by (again before swapping MB's) setting up a second hardware profile
... it can be an exact copy of the first. Swap the MB and reboot.
Windows asks which of the two profiles you want to use but gives a
third option "none". Select none and windows will redetect the
hardware.

Both these methods, although unofficial will normally work. It sounds
like you didn't do either. Therefore Windows is trying to run the MB
with mis-matched drivers, most importantly the HD chipset drivers may
be quite different - in which case you won't complete the boot.

It may be too late now, but you could try putting the old MB back and
using the above method (with each OS if it's a multi-boot). Personally
I'd play better safe than sorry, bite the bullet and re-install

> AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAARRRGGGHHH!!!!!!.........................................................
>
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>
> Anyone?..... Please.......

Reply to this Message

FlyBoy - 27 Oct 2004 18:10 GMT

>As I understand it (correct me if I'm wrong), you have changed
>motherboards on a system with Windows already installed.

Yup

>As far as I know, the only *officially* (Microsoft) recommended way to
>do this is to do a clean re-install of windows at the same time so
[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
>someone else here should confirm). Then you install the new MB,
>re-boot and windows is forced to redetect the hardware.

During one phase (after re-installing and the automatic restore of the
registry) I succeeded in booting to safe mode and I did delete the
ENUM key. I have used that trick with success before but in this
instance it didn't do a simple hardware detection after that and I
still had to do a scanreg /fix deleting 3/4 of the registry.

>You can also accomplish the same thing without editing the registry,
>by (again before swapping MB's) setting up a second hardware profile
>... it can be an exact copy of the first. Swap the MB and reboot.
>Windows asks which of the two profiles you want to use but gives a
>third option "none". Select none and windows will redetect the
>hardware.

Know that trick too. Not sure it works though.
The old MoBo doesn't boot any more. Black screen.... Nothing....
Both the ENUM key deletion and the hardware profiles probably only
work if there isn't some additional registry problem. That's why I
need a utility that allows me to repair the registry of that corrupted
Windows installation using ANOTHER Windows. The one I do have running.
I can access the other corrupted Windows installation from that one.
Only.... where do I find such a utility? I think I am not the only one
who could use such a utility. I think the whole Windows-using world is
in dire need of such a utility. Only no-one apparently has realised
that and made it yet. Or at least so it seems so far. :(

>Both these methods, although unofficial will normally work. It sounds
>like you didn't do either. Therefore Windows is trying to run the MB
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
>using the above method (with each OS if it's a multi-boot). Personally
>I'd play better safe than sorry, bite the bullet and re-install

As I said I have a second W98 installation which I did get to work
with no problems but that is just a pretty empty installation to be
used to repair the main installation. The others are a WinXP-Pro and a
Win2K. The XP also needing a repair install but since I have an
OEM-version it doesnt allow to do that. The CD-boot-setup only offers
a clean install. I'd need a retail or possibly an update version to do
that. @$#%^&* Micro(brain)soft(in-the-head) apparently didn't think
people with OEM versions could want to re-install over an existing
installation is case of problems or hardware change.

The whole world is led to believe that a re-installation is the norm
and do not know that the absence of an adequate option to move to
another MoBo is there mostly 'by design'. I think Micro$oft deserves a
class-action suit for damages to a few hundred million people for
waste of time and loss of data to do such re-installs when all you
need to do is to offer an option to delete (all) hardware specific
settings and do a fresh hardware detection and installation. There is
absolutely no reason why this shouldn't be possible. In fact the
repair option in the XP-retail version probably does something like
that. Only because of the illogical and stupid marketing strategies of
MicroSoft to protect only their financial interests most people cannot
do that (most people have OEM or other volume-licence versions) and
don't realise that it is a designed limitation of the Windows version
they have.

The Win2K also doesn't work but I don't think I'll bother with that
one any more.

Reply to this Message

WoofWoof - 27 Oct 2004 18:56 GMT

> During one phase (after re-installing and the automatic restore of the
> registry) I succeeded in booting to safe mode and I did delete the
> ENUM key. I have used that trick with success before but in this
> instance it didn't do a simple hardware detection after that and I
> still had to do a scanreg /fix deleting 3/4 of the registry.

Trouble is that you've already done a boot (even in safe mode) with
the old software setup on the new MB. I don't know where that would
leave you ... sort of a no-man's land. This trick (deleting the old
hardware profile and forcing re-detection) has usually been described
as "may work" or "usually works" even when done correctly. I've never
seen or heard it not working actually but there may be specific cases.
When you try to do it after the swap though, I would think your
chances of a successful outcome are reduced.

> >You can also accomplish the same thing without editing the registry,
> >by (again before swapping MB's) setting up a second hardware profile
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
>
> Know that trick too. Not sure it works though.

I've done it that way a number of, and it's always worked for me. It's
only slightly different from the first method actually, in that it
creates and uses new enum key in addition to the old one instead of
replacing the old one.

> The old MoBo doesn't boot any more. Black screen.... Nothing....
> Both the ENUM key deletion and the hardware profiles probably only
[quoted text clipped - 15 lines]
> >using the above method (with each OS if it's a multi-boot). Personally
> >I'd play better safe than sorry, bite the bullet and re-install

> The whole world is led to believe that a re-installation is the norm
> and do not know that the absence of an adequate option to move to
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
> need to do is to offer an option to delete (all) hardware specific
> settings and do a fresh hardware detection and installation.

" ...all you need to do is to offer an option to delete (all) hardware
specific settings and do a fresh hardware detection and
installation"

If that *is* all that needs to be done you may have a point. But it's
a curious statement actually, since it didn't apparently work in your
case. Now *I* think it didn't work because you didn't follow the steps
in the correct sequence but I sense from your responses that you think
that your different sequence was immaterial to the method. Now you are
proposing class-action suit because MS didn't supply a programmed
procedure for the method (which didn't work for you).

Microsoft has never stated that this method would work at all ... and
it's quite possible that won't work in some specific installations.

Although I've used this method myself a number of times in the past
I'm less inclined to do it these days (even - perhaps especially - on
2000/XP). On balance I thinK a MB change is an excellent time to
overhaul the whole system with a drastic review of just which
installed apps etc I really need (usually I dump about 70%) obtaining
all the latest drivers (and putting them on a single CD for
convenience) etc .. Then a complete disk surface test, reformat and
re-install. It all doesn't take nearly as long as some people imagine
(and certainly not as long as patching up a flakey system) and I end
up with a system that boots faster, runs better and has fewer hanging
qestion marks.

Reply to this Message

FlyBoy - 27 Oct 2004 21:42 GMT

>Trouble is that you've already done a boot (even in safe mode) with
>the old software setup on the new MB. I don't know where that would
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
>When you try to do it after the swap though, I would think your
>chances of a successful outcome are reduced.

I have backups of every relevant phase but the version that did boot
on the old MoBo is the earliest version I can start from. And that one
cannot boot without a reinstall etc. etc.

>" ...all you need to do is to offer an option to delete (all) hardware
>specific settings and do a fresh hardware detection and
[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
>proposing class-action suit because MS didn't supply a programmed
>procedure for the method (which didn't work for you).

I was talking about WinXP there. A completely different issue. There I
cannot get it working because MS has removed the repair option from
OEM-versions. THAT is what I object to and the fact MS doesn't tell
it's users about that difference with the retail version.

>Microsoft has never stated that this method would work at all ... and
>it's quite possible that won't work in some specific installations.

Again... XP here. And it's an existing option in the RETAIL version.

>Although I've used this method myself a number of times in the past
>I'm less inclined to do it these days (even - perhaps especially - on
[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
>up with a system that boots faster, runs better and has fewer hanging
>qestion marks.

But it's not up to MS to decide whether I should do that. It should be
totally up to me! And you may think it's a good idea because of your
experiences. But these experiences are created by MS because of their
lacking feature to move to a different MoBo. That's why you have bad
experiences.

Also... If you read my initial posting you read that the W98
installation has hundreds of software installations in it. I'm pretty
sure you never did a complete re-install of such a system.

I would like not to go into this issue much further since it has
nothing to do with my original main question:

Does anyone know of a utility with which I can edit/clean/repair the
registry of another Windows installation? Any help with that question
would be greatly appreciated.

Reply to this Message

Jeff Richards - 27 Oct 2004 22:38 GMT

I would guess that there are still some lingering hardware problems, perhaps
RAM or CPU cache.

If you have a diagnostic, give it a good run - such as overnight.

Software patching and re-installing will never overcome flaky hardware.

Signature

Jeff Richards
MS MVP (Windows - Shell/User)

>
> AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAARRRGGGHHH!!!!!!.........................................................
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>
> Anyone?..... Please.......

Reply to this Message

Kyuso Cahi - 31 Oct 2004 00:23 GMT

FlyBoy wrote:

> How am I expected to repair my registry when the problem with the
> registry prohibits me from booting?

The best route in your case is to clean install, and install all patches to
the motherboard chipsets. Just make sure to back up all your data before
proceeding.

I strongly recommend using linux booting to try to get at your data.

It could also be a hardware problem. Try to install linux for testing. Linux
pushes the limits of hardware, and it will eventually fail if it's hardware
problem.

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