Annoying problems starting 98 and with WiFi on 1st Ed

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news.microsoft.com - 28 Jan 2006 00:27 GMT

I am running this old IBM i1400 steamer which I THINK had first edition
loaded

It continuously (40% of the time) gives me "Windows Protection Error You
Need To Restart Your Computer" error messages just after the splash screen.
This can only be corrected by going into safe mode and restarting from
there. Then it seems quite happy going into windows

It also always gives an error message telling me that the display driver is
incorrect for the hardware. I can cancel out of it into VGA mode but not
much else Trying to agree gives me the BSOD. Obviously OKing and
restarting as it recommends only gives me the same error message all over
again.

So I downloaded the updated display driver from the IBM site which
auto-identified the system and it did nothing to help this problem with the
Neomagic 128 display. So I tried to use the driver from Driverguide.com
which was slightly earlier than the IBM one (Probably the same) and it
didn't help either.

And there is a problem with my WiFi card. It loads its config utility (and
works fine) about 50% of the time. Otherwise Linksys tells me that it cant
really be made to work without Second Edition. Generally the whole system
crashes with either a BSOD when the card is installed or an error which wont
go away and which stops the whole computer from closing if you try to cancel
out of it

System Info SFC doesn't tell me that there are any wrong files and nor does
Registry Checker. (nor does Systemworks WinDoctor)

QUESTION: Is there a cure for all of this or is the cure to upgrade to
Second Edition? If so, how? (obviously I Have Second Edition install discs)
It obviously isn't worthwhile reinstalling all the software (on a system
which isn't my primary system) in time wasted alone. I only have 64 Meg of
memory so I cant install 2000.

Reply to this Message

Jeff Richards - 28 Jan 2006 04:02 GMT

While upgrading won't fix all the problems, it seems that it's necessary if
you want to use that WiFi card. You won't have to re-install your
applications if you upgrade. However, the better option would be start over
with a fresh operating system, and then only install what you really need.
http://home.satx.rr.com/badour/html/w98_restore.html

Signature

Jeff Richards
MS MVP (Windows - Shell/User)

>I am running this old IBM i1400 steamer which I THINK had first edition
>loaded
[quoted text clipped - 31 lines]
> system which isn't my primary system) in time wasted alone. I only have
> 64 Meg of memory so I cant install 2000.

Reply to this Message

news.microsoft.com - 28 Jan 2006 15:55 GMT

Yes, I suspected that was my only option but I was just wondering whether
these were symptoms which are easily remediable: I have read that deleting
win.com might cure some of them, which being the case I might as well just
upgrade, which involves deleting win.com before performing the upgrade.

My only worry is that I have upgraded numerous times using this method
invariably successfully. But I have ALWAYS done it with a proper working
system. I was just a bit worried about doing it with a system which isn't
really working properly.

Some of what I am trying to retain here are the Thinkpad-specific files
which can only be retained by using a Restore Disc which I don't have: There
again, the Thinkpad specific display driver and its upgrade is one of the
problems with this system! Although an old file, this is the only example
of an IBM provided file causing problems. They are usually not only the most
reliable systems on the market, they always did continue to support their
older systems with patches even after they had reached supposed end of life
if a problem cropped up (possibly because they are so well built that those
types of problem almost never cropped up?)

> While upgrading won't fix all the problems, it seems that it's necessary
> if you want to use that WiFi card. You won't have to re-install your
[quoted text clipped - 37 lines]
>> system which isn't my primary system) in time wasted alone. I only have
>> 64 Meg of memory so I cant install 2000.

Reply to this Message

Jeff Richards - 28 Jan 2006 21:53 GMT

You are quite correct in assuming that upgrading a faulty system might not
work or might not cure the problem.

There is no need to delete WIN.COM before upgrading.

Thinkpad software is available for download:
http://www-307.ibm.com/pc/support/site.wss/product.do?

Signature

Jeff Richards
MS MVP (Windows - Shell/User)

> Yes, I suspected that was my only option but I was just wondering whether
> these were symptoms which are easily remediable: I have read that deleting
[quoted text clipped - 15 lines]
> supposed end of life if a problem cropped up (possibly because they are so
> well built that those types of problem almost never cropped up?)

Reply to this Message

news.microsoft.com - 28 Jan 2006 22:04 GMT

> You are quite correct in assuming that upgrading a faulty system might not
> work or might not cure the problem.
> There is no need to delete WIN.COM before upgrading.

I suspect there is if you only have a Windows 98 install disc to do it with
(and anyway one of hte solutions on the MS site to the windows protection
error message seems to be to delete win.com)

> Thinkpad software is available for download:
> http://www-307.ibm.com/pc/support/site.wss/product.do?

Not sure this would help

>> There again, the Thinkpad specific display driver and its upgrade is one
>> of the problems with this system!

Reply to this Message

Jeff Richards - 28 Jan 2006 22:47 GMT

If you are deleting WIN.COM because that forces Windows to replace more
files during the upgrade and therefore might get rid of the errors, don't
bother because it's a waste of time and effort. Do a fresh install instead.
From your comment it seems that's what your installation disk was designed
for, and any other procedure is likely to create the problems you are seeing
rather than fix them.

Microsoft instructions have to be evaluated very cautiously if you are using
anything other than a standard MS installation CD. And IBM machines seem
very susceptible to errors (including hardware damage) if you are using
anything other than the correct IBM installation CD.

Signature

Jeff Richards
MS MVP (Windows - Shell/User)

>
>> You are quite correct in assuming that upgrading a faulty system might
[quoted text clipped - 10 lines]
>>> There again, the Thinkpad specific display driver and its upgrade is one
>>> of the problems with this system!

Reply to this Message

news.microsoft.com - 29 Jan 2006 17:13 GMT

> If you are deleting WIN.COM because that forces Windows to replace more
> files during the upgrade and therefore might get rid of the errors, don't
> bother because it's a waste of time and effort. Do a fresh install
> instead. From your comment it seems that's what your installation disk was
> designed for, and any other procedure is likely to create the problems you
> are seeing rather than fix them.

But isnt there some software out there which looks at windows installations
and tells you what is wrong with them if things are THIS bad? Norton
Windoctor doesnt do this and SFC doesnt seem to do an adequate job

> Microsoft instructions have to be evaluated very cautiously if you are
> using anything other than a standard MS installation CD. And IBM machines
> seem very susceptible to errors (including hardware damage) if you are
> using anything other than the correct IBM installation CD.

The only one I Have lying around is a similar 600E recovery-install disc

Reply to this Message

Jeff Richards - 30 Jan 2006 08:22 GMT

There is no application that can diagnose a faulty system in the way you
describe. SFC is only as good as its database of version numbers, and you
can't tell when it's giving good advice and when it's not. Windoctor usually
causes more problems than it solves.

You have to attack each problem as it occurs using proper diagnostic and
debugging techniques (including diagnostic software where appropriate), or
re-install to a newly formatted hard drive. There's no shortcut.

Signature

Jeff Richards
MS MVP (Windows - Shell/User)

>
>> If you are deleting WIN.COM because that forces Windows to replace more
[quoted text clipped - 12 lines]
>> you are using anything other than the correct IBM installation CD.
> The only one I Have lying around is a similar 600E recovery-install disc

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