WMP11 plugin not included for use in Firefox

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Richard Mitnick - 24 Mar 2007 21:34 GMT

Along with making it almost impossible to de-select file types in WMP11 in
Vista, MSFT has seeb fit to not include in Vista the plugin necessary to have
WMP work with Firefox and SeaMonkey. This arrogance, in the face ofd the fact
that in WinXP, WMP10 and WMP11 both worked fine with Firefox and SeaMonkey.

This is why MSFT keeps getting sued.

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zachd [MSFT] - 24 Mar 2007 21:45 GMT

What association issue are you having troubles with? How does Vista's
"Program Defaults" control panel, available on the Start Menu, not meet your
needs? That is more comprehensive than previous association methods.

The Windows Media Player Netscape 3.0 plug-in from 1998 that you're
referring to is kind of old. Third party compatibility is a key feature,
but that plug-in from 1998 isn't really a great solution.

Signature

Speaking for myself only.
See http://zachd.com/pss/pss.html for some helpful WMP info.
This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and confers no rights.
--

> Along with making it almost impossible to de-select file types in WMP11 in
> Vista, MSFT has seeb fit to not include in Vista the plugin necessary to
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
>
> This is why MSFT keeps getting sued.

Reply to this Message

Richard Mitnick - 28 Mar 2007 01:12 GMT

Hey, thanks for your speedy rfeply.

You asked, "What association issue are you having troubles with? How does
Vista's"Program Defaults" control panel, available on the Start Menu, not
meet your needs? "

I think that I was pretty clear: if I go to WMP and want to de-select file
type associations, there does not appear to be any way to get the check marks
out of the boxes. Mind you, I have no problem with WMP11. I have it
configured the way I want (which was a lot of work), the CD burning function
is quick and easy, the ID-3 tagging works well, and syncing my mp3 player is
fine. WMP is a fine replacement for AMusicmZatch in these areas. But, should
I want to select another player as my default, I should be able to de-select
the file types in WMP. If you can tell me how to get those check marks out of
those boxes, I will appreciate it.

You further wrote,

"The Windows Media Player Netscape 3.0 plug-in from 1998 that you're

> referring to is kind of old. Third party compatibility is a key feature,
> but that plug-in from 1998 isn't really a great solution."

I wanted to see a Frontline Video from WBGH that I had missed on TV. I knew
it was available at the web site. I choose to use Firefox as my default
browser (because, frankly, I am lazy and with FF or SeaMonkey, I can save all
of my user id's and passwords without having to pay for Roboform). WGBH asked
for either WMP or Quicktime. I should have had WMP available. I will not use
Quicktime. In the end, I did have two choices which are really one chboice:
IE7 or IE Tab in FF, which is still IE7. I should have been able to use
Firefox with no difficulty.

Actually, what I did was to go back to my XP machine and use Firefox there.

So, MSFT has limited my ability to organize my computer the way I want, and
this is less freedom in Vista than I had in XP. If the Netscape 3.0 plugin is
"kind of old" then it should be replaced. Who does that? MSFT or Mozilla
Corp? Reading in the Mozilla KB, it says that MSFT did not include... which
sounds like MSFT needs to re-do the plugin.

In the end, it is my computer, I am agreeing to EULA's and then should be
free to use my computer as I wish.

::RSM

> What association issue are you having troubles with? How does Vista's
> "Program Defaults" control panel, available on the Start Menu, not meet your
[quoted text clipped - 13 lines]
> >
> > This is why MSFT keeps getting sued.

Reply to this Message

zachd [MSFT] - 28 Mar 2007 09:06 GMT

> Hey, thanks for your speedy rfeply.

> You asked, "What association issue are you having troubles with? How does
> Vista's"Program Defaults" control panel, available on the Start Menu, not
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
> marks
> out of the boxes.

Do you have those checkboxes? That's not an option in Vista, so if you
*are* using Vista, it would be very unclear how you would be able to see
those checkboxes within WMP. WMP runs under least-privileged-user on Vista,
which means by default it shouldn't have Admin privileges and that dialog
shouldn't exist.

Regardless of system, that dialog has only ever been able to roll back to an
existing association and not "strip" the system of associations. So if you
wanted to install a second application and have it handle stuff: it should
just work.

If not, what application? That sounds like a bug in their application at
that point... if you really are on Vista, that may be a relevant point, but
I don't know how I can reconcile that with the perhaps-existence of the File
Types dialog here... ?

I'm confused but interested. I apologize for my confusion. =)

> Mind you, I have no problem with WMP11. I have it
> configured the way I want (which was a lot of work), the CD burning
[quoted text clipped - 8 lines]
> of
> those boxes, I will appreciate it.

Note that WMP doesn't have any "reassociation" feature: those checkboxes
aren't "persistent associations", they're just the current state of
associations. So install another app and the checkboxes will unfill.

Does that make sense? If you completely strip associations in Windows, you
lose data. You can certainly do that by hand if you want, but it's not
really something WMP or any player needs to be doing for you.

Signature

Speaking for myself only.
See http://zachd.com/pss/pss.html for some helpful WMP info.
This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and confers no rights.

Reply to this Message

Richard Mitnick - 28 Mar 2007 11:58 GMT

Thanks, a lot to answer, I will try to go in order:
The check boxes are not in WMP11 in Vista, they are accessed by the "path"
Start>Default Programs>Set your default programs

then

Select Media Player as the default> Choose defaults for this program

Then one gets a page showing all of the file types associated with WMP11.
All are checked. There is on top a box to check for Select All, or uncheck,
which I assumed would un-select all of the file types.

And, yes, I am definitely using a Vista machine.

Thanks.

::RSM

> > Hey, thanks for your speedy reply.
>
[quoted text clipped - 45 lines]
> lose data. You can certainly do that by hand if you want, but it's not
> really something WMP or any player needs to be doing for you.

Reply to this Message

zachd [MSFT] - 30 Mar 2007 07:34 GMT

Oh no, that's "Choose Defaults *for* this program", as opposed to Take Stuff
Away From...
I know what you mean here, it's just not what you think it is though - this
whole negative state gets tricky quickly since rollback would need to
maintain previous owner, which can be difficult/impossible to track
correctly.

So: if you want to reassociate to a second application, you would just need
to associate to that.

Again: what application? They should register for this. It's not hard. =)

Signature

Speaking for myself only.
See http://zachd.com/pss/pss.html for some helpful WMP info.
This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and confers no rights.
--

> Thanks, a lot to answer, I will try to go in order:
> The check boxes are not in WMP11 in Vista, they are accessed by the "path"
[quoted text clipped - 76 lines]
>> lose data. You can certainly do that by hand if you want, but it's not
>> really something WMP or any player needs to be doing for you.

Reply to this Message

zachd [MSFT] - 30 Mar 2007 07:45 GMT

> Again: what application? They should register for this. It's not hard.
> =)

I also wrote up mock-ups for several third party applications for
testing/knowledge, so if it's one of the bigger players, I may have a
registration for them laying around, and if not -- a) they should do this
for you and it's not hard and b) you could use either the MSDN docs (are
they up yet?) or a template from me to do this yourself/themself.

I love third party players. Everybody drives everybody to be better.
*thumbs up*

Signature

Speaking for myself only.
See http://zachd.com/pss/pss.html for some helpful WMP info.
This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and confers no rights.

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Neil Smith [MVP Digital Media] - 28 Mar 2007 15:50 GMT

>"The Windows Media Player Netscape 3.0 plug-in from 1998 that you're
>> referring to is kind of old. Third party compatibility is a key feature,
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
>of my user id's and passwords without having to pay for Roboform). WGBH asked
>for either WMP or Quicktime. I should have had WMP available.

WGBH's detection routines are broken then :-p

>Quicktime. In the end, I did have two choices which are really one chboice:
>IE7 or IE Tab in FF, which is still IE7. I should have been able to use
>Firefox with no difficulty.

You don't need IE Tab. You could instead use the FF ActiveX plugin :
http://www.iol.ie/~locka/mozilla/plugin.htm

That would definitely fire up WMP11 control not the old Netscape
control (I know, because we've tested it in our video application)

>So, MSFT has limited my ability to organize my computer the way I want, and
>this is less freedom in Vista than I had in XP. If the Netscape 3.0 plugin is
>"kind of old" then it should be replaced. Who does that? MSFT or Mozilla

It is being. The WPF/E control will be the new replacement for WMV and
WMA playback, and operates in Firefox1, 2 and IE6, 7 as well as Safari
and Opera. I'm testing it over the next few weeks to make sure it does
what it says on the tin, and have got hold of some contacts to provide
feedback to fix it, if it doesn't do so.

>In the end, it is my computer, I am agreeing to EULA's and then should be
>free to use my computer as I wish.

At this point I recommend you consider BSD or Linux, since with Vista
the machine is far from "your machine" when it comes to media routing.

Cheers - Neil
------------------------------------------------
Digital Media MVP : 2004-2007
http://mvp.support.microsoft.com/mvpfaqs

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Neil Smith [MVP Digital Media] - 26 Mar 2007 19:42 GMT

>Along with making it almost impossible to de-select file types in WMP11 in
>Vista, MSFT has seeb fit to not include in Vista the plugin necessary to have
>WMP work with Firefox and SeaMonkey. This arrogance, in the face ofd the fact
>that in WinXP, WMP10 and WMP11 both worked fine with Firefox and SeaMonkey.

The WMP browser plugin will be superceded for mose cases by the WPF/E
plugin which is currently in Feb CTP. It offers support for browser
playback of WMA and WMV in firefox, opera, safari and IE on both PC
and Mac.

Cheers - Neil
------------------------------------------------
Digital Media MVP : 2004-2007
http://mvp.support.microsoft.com/mvpfaqs

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Richard Mitnick - 28 Mar 2007 01:01 GMT

Thanks for your reply.

What is "WPF/E" and what is "Feb CTP", and how do access this or these?

And, what about the difficulty in un-selecting file types?

Thanks.

::RSM

> >Along with making it almost impossible to de-select file types in WMP11 in
> >Vista, MSFT has seeb fit to not include in Vista the plugin necessary to have
[quoted text clipped - 10 lines]
> Digital Media MVP : 2004-2007
> http://mvp.support.microsoft.com/mvpfaqs

Reply to this Message

Neil Smith [MVP Digital Media] - 28 Mar 2007 15:57 GMT

WPF/E is a browser plugin microsoft are currently working on. It
stands for "windows presentation foundation /everywhere" but I guess a
more friendly name will come atached when it hits the streets. It's
similar to a cutdown version of WMF which is used in Vista UI's
amongst other places, and runs in the browser like any activeX control
/ embed / java applet.

CTP means "community technical preview", that is : "it's being worked
on but not yet finalised until feedback about required features is
stacked up and fed into the product process"

The plugin would need to be installed on each browser type you want to
use day to day, and websites would need to begin to rewrite or extend
their plugin support to add that. Expression web (a replacement for
Frontpage) has capabilities to work with WPF/E content.

In many ways it's a MS-centric type of Flash, with support for WMA and
WMV content, as well as time based animation, vector graphics and so
on. Since SVG hasn't really made headway, I suppose it's also MS' take
on SVG and a replacement for HTML+TIME (which was always a lame duck)

For details and demos, see :
http://msdn2.microsoft.com/en-us/asp.net/bb187358.aspx
http://channel9.msdn.com/ShowPost.aspx?PostID=263364
http://msdn2.microsoft.com/en-us/asp.net/bb187452.aspx

Cheers - Neil

>Thanks for your reply.
>
[quoted text clipped - 20 lines]
>> Digital Media MVP : 2004-2007
>> http://mvp.support.microsoft.com/mvpfaqs

------------------------------------------------
Digital Media MVP : 2004-2007
http://mvp.support.microsoft.com/mvpfaqs

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